Radical Depopulation Of The Earth - The Solution To Mankind's Problems?

[Richard]

Indicators of human welfare have been rising in the West for centuries...

[wmiddlemas]

Absolutely....over population in the west is less of a problem than in some other countries. Still populations in the West are stressing available resources and current lifestyles are not sustainable in the longterm.

[forfismum]

Originally Posted by wmiddlemas

Absolutely....over population in the west is less of a problem than in some other countries. Still populations in the West are stressing available resources and current lifestyles are not sustainable in the longterm.

When I started studying earth sciences in 1971 some of the books on the course were what I can only describe as propaganda from the Club of Rome. "Resources and man " springs to mind and I think according to that tome we were due to have run out of everything by 1995.Strangely this did not happen.I think you Malthusians overlook the resourcefulness of man in your tortured deliberations.

[Richard]

Originally Posted by wmiddlemas

Absolutely....over population in the west is less of a problem than in some other countries. Still populations in the West are stressing available resources and current lifestyles are not sustainable in the longterm.

Resource availability isn't a fixed amount though, there isn't for instance a fixed amount of potable water in the world. People tend to create resources when needed, find substitutes, increase the efficiency of what they are already using and so on. Problems can occur if the rate of resource use increases so fast that there isn't time to adapt, but even in these cases problems tend to be short term as societies concentrate on overcoming their problems. There may be blips where progress goes backwards in some regions but these tend to be temporary.

[wmiddlemas]

Well predictions of the effects of the population bomb is not an exact science by any means... so they missed some of their dire predictions by 20 years are so - that is not too bad. The fact is that oil production peaked in the US in the 1970's and will peak in Saudi Arabia within a decade or so. The world won't see much more oil availability than the 87 million barrels being produced today. World demand (because of population growth primarily) is rising, oil availability is fixed and will inevitably fall.... that leads to a bad scenario. Food production and the world's standard of living is directly related to oil. Already, the era of cheap food has passed. Just the recent rise in food prices is already causing food riots in Africa and great stress to people in other parts of the world. So, I think we are seeing the beginning of the impact of the "population bomb"

[forfismum]

Originally Posted by wmiddlemas

Well predictions of the effects of the population bomb is not an exact science by any means... so they missed some of their dire predictions by 20 years are so - that is not too bad.

They missed by alot more that that as we have not run out of anything yet and don't seem likely to do so anyday soon.

The fact is that oil production peaked in the US in the 1970's and will peak in Saudi Arabia within a decade or so. The world won't see much more oil availability than the 87 million barrels being produced today.

Iraq,Siberia,Brazil,the Arctic all have a capacity that you seem to have overlooked.Also recovery of the 2/3rds of Ameriacn oil still in the wells looks more economical as the science of recovery advances.As nuclear power reduces the need to burn oil to generate electricity and as engines become ever more efficient demand for oil will drop and the resources will last longer.Home heating by solar power and the use of heat-pumps etc will further reduce demand.

Already, the era of cheap food has passed. Just the recent rise in food prices is already causing food riots in Africa and great stress to people in other parts of the world. So, I think we are seeing the beginning of the impact of the "population bomb"

Food prices have nothing to do with population numbers right now as you incorrectly state.High prices are due to speculation,hoarding and corruption with a bit of bad weather to add to the mix.Africa has never reached its potential for food production and ouput there continues to fall.Europe seems to given up on farming and has turned into a theme park,none of my neighbours are allowed to produce a fraction of what they can achieve.Nothing to do with numbers,just politics.

[prashamk]

Originally Posted by forfismum

Food prices have nothing to do with population numbers right now as you incorrectly state.High prices are due to speculation,hoarding and corruption with a bit of bad weather to add to the mix.Africa has never reached its potential for food production and ouput there continues to fall.Europe seems to given up on farming and has turned into a theme park,none of my neighbours are allowed to produce a fraction of what they can achieve.Nothing to do with numbers,just politics.

Very true about Africa. Most of the countries of EU who had ruled various areas of africa have tortured the local like anything. Firstly their government looted them and now the MNC of EU are doing the same. Instead of guiding them towards the right path they are lured into wrong habits and practices.

But If their resources are utilized in right manner we can have huge explosion in production of food stuff.

[forfismum]

Lest any of our beloved readers in the colonies feel cheated remember that I post from a former colony of the British Empire. But we were different.We got shitty leaders at first and then things got better,most of Africa seems to have started well at independence and have gone downhill ever since.

[wmiddlemas]

The world is running out of oil and fresh water - in the coming decade you will see major shortages in these two areas the American Southwest will be one of many areas where a major water crisis will occur.

As far as undiscovered, untapped oil supplies... first, I don't know of too many people who treasure the environment and the beauty of this planet who would sanction drilling in the Arctic, but notwithstanding that, demand is rising much faster than new oil discoveries so the trend in the price of oil will continue to rise eliminating cheap food as we have known in the past. That and rising population will condemn the developing overpopulated world to ever escalating conflicts.

I didn't say that food prices were the immediate result of over population it is more directly the price of oil and the use of corn to produce biofuels.

[prashamk]

Originally Posted by forfismum

Lest any of our beloved readers in the colonies feel cheated remember that I post from a former colony of the British Empire. But we were different.

Nothing personal here.

Originally Posted by forfismum

most of Africa seems to have started well at independence and have gone downhill ever since.

Please elaborate.