Imagine a world without plastics

[deek]

I think we are in agreement that an alternative fuel source is required and the hunt is most definitely on to find the "silver bullet".

However, how are we going to cope in our future world without plastics (derived from hydrocarbons). Has much thought been given to this?

If we can't have fossil fuel then we can't have plastics either. How are we going to address this catastrophic problem. Just have a look around, I'll bet there are very few people on this vast planet that don't heavily depend on plastics in every day life. I think major life style changes will be required in the years to come.

[spadlet]

Originally Posted by deek

However, how are we going to cope in our future world without plastics (derived from hydrocarbons). Has much thought been given to this?

If we can't have fossil fuel then we can't have plastics either. How are we going to address this catastrophic problem. Just have a look around, I'll bet there are very few people on this vast planet that don't heavily depend on plastics in every day life. I think major life style changes will be required in the years to come.

Hydrocarbons are chains consisting predominantly of carbon and hydrogen. They are the building blocks of life. Fossil fuels originated from living creatures, the original producers of the hyrdocarbons. As long as you have life you will have a potential supply of hydrocarbons. The issue is one of who you can convert those hydrocarbons into plastics and whether plastics are worth the resources required. Don't worry, they already make packaging that is transparent, waterproof etc from potato starch, and McGardener knows of some using corn starch. We don't depend upon fossil fuels for plastic manufature. The current industry is just based around the use of fossil fuels as the feedstock.

[Besoeker]

Originally Posted by deek

However, how are we going to cope in our future world without plastics (derived from hydrocarbons). Has much thought been given to this.

I'm old enough to remember life largely without plastics. When plastic items started to come into use they were considered to be cheap inferior goods.
But life moves on and plastics have made the manufacture of many things simpler, cheaper and sometimes more durable.
However, if we had to live without them, we probably could and would.

[prashamk]

Same like chinese stuff... when the reached markets first, they were looked upon as cheep stuff... but now with sky high prices of all kinds of items, they are the only options left.

[prashamk]

Imaging a plastic free world is next to impossible. Whatever we do we shall have some traces of plastic in our lives.

[deek]

Originally Posted by spadlet

Don't worry, they already make packaging that is transparent, waterproof etc from potato starch, and McGardener knows of some using corn starch. We don't depend upon fossil fuels for plastic manufature. The current industry is just based around the use of fossil fuels as the feedstock.

Okay spadlet, I hear what you are saying, but I don't think your reply inspires confidence that we will have replacements for current grade plastics. I think this all very much at the pie in the sky/experimental stage and would be unlikely to satisfy the demand for high grade plastics used in many industries (e.g. electronics, electrical and power distribution, to name but a few) and then we have a huge volume requirement for products that require medium to low grade plastics. My question is; how is this demand going to be satisfied?

There was talk a few years back that biofuels (e.g. from industrial rapeseed) could be used to manufacture some plastics. Whilst this advance in biotechnology should be applauded, there is no way that growing industrial crops is going to meet the world demand for plastics, more-so in future years where land use will probably have to be designated for food crops only due to growing food shortages.

Besoeker, your comment "However, if we had to live without them, we probably could and would". With reference to my comments above, I'm sure you will agree that it is not quite that simple is it, unless were willing to turn back the clock at least 60/70 years and move forward without the modern technologies, comforts and life styles that we take so much for granted in the 21st century where electronic communication is king.

[spadlet]

Originally Posted by deek

I think this all very much at the pie in the sky/experimental stage and would be unlikely to satisfy the demand for high grade plastics used in many industries (e.g. electronics, electrical and power distribution, to name but a few) and then we have a huge volume requirement for products that require medium to low grade plastics.

Do you want to start a new game? Someone thinks of a specific use for a plastic, then people have to try and come up with either examples where it can be manufactured from non fossil fuel based substances or an alternative, non fossil based substance, that exibits the required properties and might be a realistic alternative. Then people can suggest reasons for and against the alternatives.

[Cricket Tragic]

There are many existing alternatives to petroleum plastics, some finding wider uses than others. Some of you may remember those styrofoam peanuts used for packaging, nowadays all I see are packing peanuts made from cornstarch. These work just as well, but are also biodegradable. I also get cornstarch freezer bags.

Plastics is a broad term that encompasses a range of polymers that may be of petroleum or other manufacture. Plastics are an extraordinarily flexible and useful material and we should not really expect that all uses of plastics will disappear. Whether and how fast petroleum plastic products are replaced will in the end depend on the relative economics of the various input streams (as influenced by Government regulation of course and the cost of energy). We are already seeing some petroleum plastics phased out and starch resources replace them. For other uses, we may see non-plastic replacements. That is replacement articles that do not have the properties of plastics. In a small minority of cases, we may simply go back to what we did before plastics came along.

[Besoeker]

Originally Posted by deek

Besoeker, your comment "However, if we had to live without them, we probably could and would". With reference to my comments above, I'm sure you will agree that it is not quite that simple is it, unless were willing to turn back the clock at least 60/70 years and move forward without the modern technologies, comforts and life styles that we take so much for granted in the 21st century where electronic communication is king.

Yes, I take your point that it wouldn't be simple. There are many things that exist now because we have plastics to make them with. Or put otherwise, wouldn't exist, at least not in the same form, without the availability of plastics.