Hurricane Wilma 'strongest ever' = Global Warming

[Richard]

Zoltan,

It's actually because of increased sun-spot activity. It's got nothing to do with human-induced climate change.

[Zoltan Paul Jambor]

Originally Posted by TheRobster

Zoltan,

It's actually because of increased sun-spot activity. It's got nothing to do with human-induced climate change.

Where did you hear that nonsense?

Do elaborate.

ZPJ

[Richard]

Originally Posted by Zoltan Paul Jambor

Where did you hear that nonsense?

Do elaborate.

ZPJ

I came to that conclusion the same way that you came to yours. I held a pre-conceived notion about something and then looked for evidence to support my case.

http://cse.ssl.berkeley.edu/segwayed...research7.html

Currently, there are scientists whose research with this kind of data makes them believe that the Sun has the strongest influence on all climatic changes here on earth--that known climate changes can be shown to correlate to changes in solar activity.

So, the earth's climate is obviously effected by the sun. Sun-spot activity is at an 8000 year high, therefore the current adverse climate conditions are caused by the increased sun-spot activity.

Hurricane Wilma 'strongest hurricane ever' = Increased sun-spot activity.

[S]

ok guys its ok im here to tell you the truth :P

sunspots..yes! and what are sunspots boys & girls? magnetic fields...and what would that effect? the earth...which would relate to this, but noone was listening

[Richard]

Actually you're all wrong. It's because of the Zargon mothership which is currently hiding behind Venus and is firing it's Climate_Death_Ray at us.

[MarkuisMellvile]

Do I do the job I do, just to pay the bills, or am I telling property developers, architects and occupants to reduce their energy consumption, generate power on-site and use what power they consume more efficiently just for fun?

Neither!

I'm doing it because I agree that climate change is (along with others) an issue that humanity must do what it can to tackle. I cannot, however, present to my clients scare stories, unless what they perceive as scary I can back up with solid facts.

But this isn't about me. I stated the obvious in my first post in this thread. Whatever any of us believes to be true about the cause of an individual storm, while global warming logically will see us suffering more (and stronger) storms from now on, we humans cannot fully comprehend how much or how fast our influence on the climate will impact our daily lives. Not beyond saying that we are obviously affecting our world, and should be doing more to cut down on the death, destruction and inequity that most of our species imposes on anything that gets in their way.

Both of you believe as passionaetly as I do, in what you have to say, but as an engineer I can't accept mathematical identities that do not hold true in all cases. anything=anything or something=something is known as an identity, and unless both sides are exactly equal, then the statement is false.

[antiHype]

Originally Posted by MarkuisMellvile

Like Zoltan, I'm of the opinion that more, stronger storms are the direct result of humanity's continued ignorance and greed, but no individual weather event can be attributed to the outdated phrase that is Global Warming.

Ignorance and greed = sins. Global warming = punishment. Nature = god.

Can you not see how utterly irrational your words look?

Originally Posted by MarkuisMellvile

I wrote my signature because I genuinely believe that humans will learn lessons in the end, but through their ignorance and greed few people will be left to see the improvement in centuries to come.

And that's a straightforward reading of the Revelations.

[Richard]

Originally Posted by antiHype

Ignorance and greed = sins. Global warming = punishment. Nature = god.

Can you not see how utterly irrational your words look?And that's a straightforward reading of the Revelations.

You don't need to believe in God to believe in ignorance and greed. I'm a self-confessed athiest and even I believe in ignorance and greed. Not as sins, but as something that people are capable of and something that is a normal (but not very wise) part of the human makeup.

[antiHype]

Originally Posted by TheRobster

You don't need to believe in God to believe in ignorance and greed. I'm a self-confessed athiest and even I believe in ignorance and greed. Not as sins, but as something that people are capable of and something that is a normal (but not very wise) part of the human makeup.

The point remains, Robster, that environmentalism still seeks to establish a morality from nature, and credits nature with both purpose and sentience. It is stark mystisism, albeit one which attempts to make itself plausible with science.

You will notice, however, that critisism of that science (perfectly legitimate in a scientific discipline) carries the consequence of being descended upon by environmentalists consumed by something not dissimilar to a jihadist fury, intent on a MORAL (not a scientific) assasination of the sceptic.

[Eurapart]

Zoltan,

ZPJ said:

3) Surface water temperatures in the Mid Atlantic and the Gulf of Mexico are 2 degrees Celcius above average. This rise in surface water temperatures is caused by the rise in atmospheric temperatures.

Please explain how surface water temperatures become 2 degrees Celsius above average as a result of a rise in air temperature. The physics I did demonstrated that the air movement over water actually cools the surface due to evaporation. This is the way human beings keep cool by perspiration. It is all to do with the latent heat of water if I remember correctly.
Which will heat up the surface of the water quicker a hairdryer set at the or a radiant electric fire? The sun is the equivalent of the electric fire.

ZPJ said;

It's time you open your eyes and stop living in your world of disbelief.

To quote the Chicken joke:
Fox Mulder's answer to why the chicken crossed the road;
"You saw the chicken cross the road with your own eyes, how many more chickens will have to cross the road before you believe it?"

Climate change isn't about belief (faith / religion) its about discussing the facts openly and developing a strategy to prevent harm to the planet and its people. To accuse MM of living in a world of disbelief is defamatory. MM is a man who has studied this subject to post graduate level at University and has now dedicated his life to mitigating climate change.

I have tried to explain in other posts that if you want someone to take up a musical instrument you can try hitting them over the head with it until they comply. The effective way though is to play a beautiful tune on it and entice that person to play it because they want to. I know which method MM uses

"The truth is out there"